Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Yugoslav submarine Mališan/archive2

Yugoslav submarine Mališan[edit]

Nominator(s): Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 21:04, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about a dinky little midget sub that was built by the Italians for harbour defence and anti-submarine warfare tasks in WWII, but was incomplete at the time of the Italian armistice in September 1943, and ended up being handed over to the Italian Social Republic (rump fascist Italy) by the Germans after capture and completion. Captured by the Yugolavs at the end of the war, they repaired and commissioned her for use as a training boat. In 1953 she became a museum boat (a long way from the sea in Zagreb), and she was recently refurbished. There has been some controversy about returning her to her Italian colours and markings rather than retaining her Yugoslav ones. I nominated it at FAC in February but RW stuff took over and I was unable to address the review comments in a timely way, so the FAC was closed. I believe I have now addressed all the comments that were outstanding (@Nikkimaria, RoySmith, Volcanoguy, and Pickersgill-Cunliffe:, see my edits here), so let's have another go! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 21:04, 26 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Generalissima's comments[edit]

Aww, this FAC has been sadly ignored thus far! Marking myself down to do a source and image review later. Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 16:16, 7 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Peacemaker67: Aighty! Images first up:

File:Podmornica CB20 (P901).jpg: Creative commons, uploaded as an own work. Looks good all around.
File:CB-20 Caproni U-Boot-Italien 1943 Zagreb TeslaMus 20220617 5.jpg. Ditto.

These are both good, but I feel they might be better if their order was swapped (ie, the restored image is used in the infobox, and the pre-restoration image for context below); since the restored apperance would be closer to the vessel as it would have appeared during its service, no?

The article is at its last and Yugoslav name, so IMHO it is far better to have the infobox image as its appearance in Yugoslav service. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:06, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And now sources.

Sources are consistently cited using SFNs. Books have ISBNs, and their cites are consistently formatted.
Shouldn't Technical Museum be credited as Nikola Tesla Technical Museum? There's a number of technical museums out there.

It was just the "Technical Museum" at the time, it only changed its name in 2015. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:06, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Obviously, it's okay to cite the Technical Museum a lot here, since it's obviously going to be an RS.
Obrana i sigurnost appears to be a blog, but it's by a clear subject matter expert, so good to go here.
tportal.hr is the one that gives me pause. This appears to be a news aggregator or portal - but at the same time, I think this article is actually being published on the cite itself, rather than posted from elsewhere. I know it's just used to cite a date, but do you know if this source is subject to any sort of editorial review? (Side note: Machine translation translated the name of the ship as "toddler" and if that's an accurate translation that's the funniest name I have ever heard for a naval vessel.)

While tportal.hr is a news aggregator/portal, it is operated by Hrvatski Telekom, which has an editorial board led by Dijana Suton, formerly executive editor at Poslovni dnevnik, a well regarded Croatian business and finance newspaper. Given it is only being used for the date the sub was unveiled, I think it is fine. Mališan is sort of a "slang" version of the English term "little one". Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:06, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Since you have one or two FAs under your belt, I feel a full spot check isn't really necessary here. I could of course try my darndest if you desire one. That's all I have for now! Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 16:58, 8 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much for your review, Generalissima! I think I've addressed your points. Regards, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:06, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

- Yes you have! I think everything here is good to go now. Support on source and image review. Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 19:52, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

HF[edit]

I'm not sure why this isn't getting any attention; I'll try to review this week. Hog Farm _Talk 15:29, 20 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support Comments from JennyOz[edit]

Hi PM, dinky indeed! Just a few bits from me...

top

add dmy template

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:06, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

ibox image

alt lower hull and dark gray paint - hyphen and spelling ie dark-grey

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:06, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

lede

she was ordered by the Italian Regia Marina (Royal Navy) for harbour defence and anti-submarine warfare tasks, - no actual mention of WWII? (until the mention of "a World War II German puppet state")

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:06, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Design and construction

Between the sail and the aft hatch was the distress buoy with a telephone - swap to specific link Rescue buoy (submarine)?

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:16, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The single rudder and diving planes were both of the semi-balanced type.[1] - "both" seems odd here with planes plural - change to 'all' or simply remove "both"?

The latter, thanks. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:16, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

According to the naval historian Zvonimir Freivogel, some sources indicate that - he is already introduced the same just above, so just Freivogel here?

Whoops, done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:16, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

When running at full speed on the surface, the boat had a range of only 450 nautical miles (830 km; 520 mi); at 5 kn (9.3 km/h; 5.8 mph) this increased to 1,400 nmi (2,600 km; 1,600 mi). - how increased? lower speed?

Yes, tried to clarify that this was more of a cruising speed. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:16, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Service history

magnetic mines - add link?

Thanks, done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Aftermath

image alt - light green paint on the lower hull and deck and light gray paint on the - hyphens light-green and light-gray... but grey

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

the tail section with the propeller and the torpedo tubes were dismantled and restored. - tail section was or remove with?

Rearranged the sentence, see if it works now? Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

while the Italians had over twenty boats of the class in service, Yugoslavia had only one. - had only one – Mališan ?

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

Delgado, James - add authorlink James P. Delgado
Fraccaroli, Aldo - add authorlink Aldo Fraccaroli

Both done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bonus

maybe add to List of ship decommissionings in 1957

Done. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry PM, I meant to add Mališan to that list article. No problem though. (I was surprised when I couldn't find categories for 'Ships commissioned in xxxx' and 'Ships decommissioned in xxxx'.) JennyOz (talk) 10:19, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That's me, JennyOz (talk) 11:11, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much for the review, Jenny! See what you think of my responses/edits. Regards, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks PM - always a pleasure. Very readable and understood by this non-MilHist editor. I'm happy to s'port. JennyOz (talk) 10:19, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Matarisvan[edit]

Hi Peacemaker67, some comments:

"Mališan in the Technical Museum...": wouldn't "Mališan at the Technical Museum..." be better from a grammatical POV?
Wdyt about splitting the first paragraph of the lead, with the breakaway paragraph beginning from "The unfinished boat..."? The first para is too long, the second one is too short, adding a third in between can help.
"The restored submarine was opened to the public...": Wouldn't "The restored submarine was put on public display..." be better? Also consider using the latter phrasing in the Aftermath section?
"and engine room aft": "and engine room at the aft", the latter looks a little wrong in naval lingo, but would help avoid WP:SEAOFBLUE. Wdyt?
"After the Kingdom of Italy surrendered": rephrasing to "After the surrender of the Kingdom of Italy" would avoid SEAOFBLUE.
What is your policy on linking to publishers in the biblio? Some editors do link, some don't. I understand if you would not want to link to avoid SEAOFBLUE.

That's all from me, cheers. Matarisvan (talk) 11:44, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]