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I've spent the last three months doing an extensive rewrite of Greece-Turkey relations. Two things stood out for me when doing this work
(1) The history with the Göktürk's and Byzantines is very interesting, written all over Wikipedia, with conflicting information and nuggets of knowledge on each page that discussed it. It needs to be pulled together, and give the Göktürk evolved over time, a page about Byzantine relations is the most constant.
(2) The Greece-Turkey relations article is way too big and removing all this content which I wrote will reduce the page size and open it up to other pages that would want to refer to it.
The conflicting priorities due to other groups threatening the Byzantine Empire give a whole different perspective which if it was on the same page will add a more balanced historical perspective. Biz (talk) 04:28, 2 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Hi @Gusfriend
You make fair points. This is my response to your comment:
Since January, people actively said nothing pre-1830 Greece had a place on this page. It's in the archives now but the thread "Opening paragraph needs a rewrite" shows that opinion from everyone (but me!).
Early January, Greece-Turkey relations was renamed. This in itself justifies the removal of content before the creation of the modern nation states (which is when Turkey was formed in 1923). I'm advocating we keep it but in summary form only. I am the reason most of these sections were expanded on this year so it's content I know well but that's because I wanted to explore everything and then decide if it belongs on Greece-Turkey relations.
I consider Draft:Foreign relations of the Byzantine Empire to be a stub. The Byzantine empire had relations with many more nations, tribes and empires. For example there is a half dozen more to be added from List of Byzantine wars and many more from the List of Byzantine battles. Just documenting one of those, the 150 years of relations with the Ottoman's, is enough to be an article
Both the Greece-Turkey relations article as well as the Byzantine Empire article are too big. Given this is also content that is of interest to other articles, it will serve Wikipedia well to consolidate this content from many other pages onto this one. It will increase accuracy and reduce the database size. For example, the section on Gorturks is a copy and paste in First Turkic Khaganate and since that was done, someone has edited it to make it more relevant to just that article losing some of the information (for context: before my rewrite it was a complete copyright violation that was copied into both articles). Less dramatic, but these specific events are repeated, such as in Istämi and Zemarchus, with other information that is worthy of expansion on but was restricted for brevity in my rewrite for Greece-Turkey relations. For the purposes of a consistent narrative and consolidated sources and knowledge, having it on one page will improve Wikipedia's accuracy. As the Byzantine Empire had such a long, broadly impacting and rich history and is one-half of the specific subject, it's the easiest default place to put something until it merits the creation of its own article. Not the least because a lot of what we know of these other tribes and empires is from Byzantine writings.
With regards to the GA review, I want note it has not started yet and there is quite a backlog; also I was starting this process in anticipation, as it will support the quality of the article.
I hope those reasons give you the additional context you need on why I'm proposing this. Biz (talk) 16:02, 3 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
