Talk:Fehime Sultan

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Verifiability[edit]

Unfortunately, this item will be deleted by ShadowRanger. if Fehime Sultan deleted, then all items will be deleted on women in the Ottoman Empire. ShadowRanger is a very strange man, I think he hates muslims

Zibi Fer ✍

Shadow Ranger must be banned because of vandalism. it deletes all the articles I write or others. all historical facts are ignored by him intentionally. if for him, the biography of fehima sultana not seem important, all the women in this category will be deleted. but it is meaningless, this Ranger is the king of wikipedia.

Zibi Fer ✍ —Preceding undated comment added 03:59, 3 April 2010 (UTC).[reply]

Hello Zibi Fer. The speedy deletion tag placed on this article seems to have been removed, so deletion doesn't look imminent. Because she was a princess, the article doesn't qualify for speedy deletion. Perhaps you could add some sources or references to the article though, as there aren't any there at the moment. The verifiability policy makes having references and sources very important so that readers can check the facts of the article. It's one of the key policies at Wikipedia, and if no sources can be found, the article may end up being deleted down the line. You seem to have made several articles with no sources. We do appreciate your contributions, but when you keep writing things with no sources, other people have to come behind you to clean them up. Also, (and I hope you don't take offence here) but it seems that English may not be your first language? You're still more than welcome to contribute here, but it makes another problem when people also have to rewrite the articles so that they can be understood more easily. I don't want you to stop contributing, but maybe you could concentrate on adding information (and sources) to articles instead of creating new ones for a while?

Another problem is how you talk to other editors. User:ShadowRangerRIT isn't an administrator so isn't deleting any articles. Also, you shouldn't accuse someone of hating Muslims, like you have above, that's quite offensive. And you have also accused him of vandalism. This doesn't seem to be the case, and isn't helping the situation. If you don't like ShadowRangerRIT's edits, you could try talking to him here: User talk:ShadowRangerRIT. If you leave comments at different article talkpages, like here, he might not see them. The best thing you can do to help these articles is to add references to reliable sources. I hope some of this helps. Feel free to ask me anything at User talk:Belovedfreak or other people at the Help desk. Regards, --Beloved Freak 10:53, 3 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've been asking him to provide reliable sources for edits for his various articles for six months. Zibi is apparently too dense to understand the concept (I assumed good faith long enough with repeated reminders that I've given up on him/her). Personally, I hate the concept of transitive notability due to being "royalty", so I considered this article deletion worthy (rather than stubbing it down like I have with the other unsourced original research Zibi has put up), but someone disagreed, so I've let it lie. Will probably stub it down in a while, because frankly, the sources for this are hard to find or non-existent, and I don't feel like spending hours digging through the local library in order to dig up information on what is, from the info he has provided, the equivalent of a state governor's family in the U.S., but because it's "royalty", even the otherwise non-notable members of the family count. —ShadowRanger ^(talk|stalk) 12:45, 3 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have already understood. but I think that ShadowRanger has any problem with me. my english is not the best, I'm trying to improve. Zibi Fer ✍

So you have deleted the article. this is discrimination. In Wikipedia you can read it, the Princess Fehime Sultan went to exile to France. In the book of Kenize Mourad, it is described. Then have all the articles about women in the Ottoman Empire will be deleted. Nowhere to be given any historical evidence.

Zibi Fer ✍ —Preceding undated comment added 18:56, 7 April 2010 (UTC).[reply]

I stubbed it down, I didn't "delete" it (nor can I). The info is still in the history, so if a reliable source for the information can be found, it can be restored.

I'd really appreciate it if you didn't keep harping on this being "discrimination"; for one, I have no idea who I'm supposed to be discriminating against, for another, I've stubbed or deleted dozens of unsourced articles on dozens of topics, from every cultural, ethnic and religious background. "Discrimination" would mean I'm treating some of them differently, and I'm not applying any stricter standard to these articles than I do to any new article.

I'd take a stab at looking up the information you mentioned, but from the looks of it, it may have only been published in French. If you know of an English translation and can provide a title (and ideally, an ISBN), I or someone else might be able to make a stab at sourcing your edits. Or you could do it yourself if you possess a copy and the relevant page numbers. Non-English language sources are frowned upon, but not forbidden in cases where English language sources don't exist. Of course, assuming that the books you describe exist, then there *is* a historical record. An unsourced Wikipedia article isn't historical evidence; that's why we want references to verify the information. —ShadowRanger ^(talk|stalk) 19:40, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

OK, you win. I write no more. please delete all my articles. For me, the thing is done. But you should with all the other articles on Ottoman women and princesses the same demand. Deleting!!!

Here is the reference of this Book:Regards from the Dead Princess: Novel of a Life by Kenize Mourad, Sabine Destree, and Anna Williams (Hardcover - Oct. 1989)

Zibi Fer ✍ —Preceding undated comment added 18:56, 7 April 2010 (UTC).[reply]

You've said this many times before. It's getting really old. If you actually wanted them deleted, you could easily add a {{db-g7}} to the top of the article to request it. Either do it, or stop whining. If I get a chance, I'll see if I can find a copy of that book, but for now it stays a stub. —ShadowRanger ^(talk|stalk) 20:14, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not a reliable source, maybe a hoax[edit]

Okay, I just made a preliminary check for this book online. According to the Google Books overview:

A daughter recreates the life of her mother in a fictional account of the life of Princess Selma, who marries a wealthy Indian rajah.

Which means this isn't actually a useful source, as the book is fictional. That is, the events, places and people described are, at best, based on real things, but it's no use as a source for a factual Wikipedia entry. —ShadowRanger ^(talk|stalk) 20:20, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

but why only with Fehime? what about all the other Ottoman women and princesses? Since there are no historical records exist

Zibi Fer ✍ —Preceding undated comment added 18:56, 7 April 2010 (UTC).[reply]

Well, if there are *no* historical records, then they aren't verifiable, and they shouldn't have articles in the first place. Extrapolating data from fictional accounts and oral histories is original research at best, and not acceptable for an encyclopedia. —ShadowRanger ^(talk|stalk) 21:50, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hello I have read the book in this book also happens princess Fehime. she went into exile to France. and probably was very beautiful and very wasteful. she died completely depleted of tuberculosis. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.181.66.110 (talk) 02:35, 10 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Fehime's secret Life[edit]

I got a Book, I will send the link also of this Book here, if it allowed.

In this Book, i read she was the spy for Mustafa Kema Pasha in the year 1918 - 1922, many Turkish Article's are tell that. But later in 1924, Mustafa Kemal Pasha told to her: "I love the betrayal but not the betrayer". By her first Husband no children, she doesnt love him etc...later divorced.

The second Marriage with Mahmud Bey in 1910, was a Morganastic Marriage, her Uncle Mehmed V. was not allowed her to married this Man. So this second Marriage was not reconized untile 1918, her other Uncle Mehmed VI.(last Sultan), reconized this Marriage. 1927 she divorced by Mahmud Bey...she went 1924 to Nice, her Husband was in Istanbul. This Mahmud Bey had two Children from his fomer Marriage.

Perihan S. (talk) 23:09, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Is the book a reliable biography that has scholarly fact checking or a sensationalist tabloid that is just churning rumors? -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 23:24, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

new source[edit]

the reliable source notice board provided this source [1] via User:Churn and change which seems to have a good deal about Fehime Sultan and so I am redacting the merge proposal. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 02:08, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]